Gettin Bummed about Capitalism in Homogenized markets

[Gearmond]

So dudes, I was lookin at some NAMM gear vids and it dawned on me how much the segment of guitar heroes (ie: the whole djent "progressive" metal scene)that most kids look up to these days are just utter corporate shills in the worst way, and the environment where they do it is the worst environment for it. like.. lets face it; metal guitars are the absolute most homogenic identical segment of the guitar market, and yet its the most booming in recent years.

so you have a buncha dudes getting free stuff for saying "yeah man this guitar ROCKS. these pickups SHRED" etc. etc. and "encouraging"(telling) all the watery eyed dudes that are always super passionate about guitar a message thats essentially "hey kid. get a shitton of expensive boutique guitars, and then you'll be something" and thats like... bummin me out on so many levels.

like 1. boutique instruments are almost always for suckers and dentists. you dont need them at all.
2. besides that, its a massively oversaturated market with next to zero variety. you can find the same combination of 8 string neck through guitar with bareknuckles and the same wood from AT LEAST 10 different companies
3. it basically explicitly sends the message that you need X gear in Y combination to make it, and that ain't cool
4. because of all the focus on this microscopic segment of the guitar world, it just perpetuates the blandness and oversaturation
5. that shit is too goddamn expensive for what it is
6. you shouldn't have to slave away and save up everything just to get to the middle of the pack

and idk... i like buying things sometimes, i mean i can't NOT be into any sort of collection type dealy without implicitly accepting this kind of capitalism on some level but theres a threshhold for that shit, you know. i like going about it like "heres something that does something new and different, maybe its worth your money" as opposed to pimping shit as "YOU NEED THIS, OR YOU ARE LITERALLY WASTING YOUR TIME BREATHING" like with this case.

man... like i got a buncha dudes that like this stuff, and i like some of it, but I think of all the money they've wasted buying new guitars, and selling old ones and i just thing like thats soooo toxic and counterintuitive. not trying to talk down to dudes who do this, and i'm p sure most of y'all don't have like 3 or 4 identical superstrats, or if you do they usually cost less than rent for a bomb-ass apartment for 4 months

i dunno, basically just a bro level chat about how sometimes the guitar industry is dumb and exploitative or w/e

[IEatCats]

Yeah, the inability to buy expensive gear is part of what made me start playing fuzz rock. I used to own a 7 string and play shred, but I'm broke as fuck, so I stopped. (I do still want an 8 though.)

[D.o.S.]

Once you stop paying full price for things you'll go out of your way to keep getting the hookup.

In other words, you just gotta go pro, brah.

[Gearmond]

thats hardly a positive thing, tho

[D.o.S.]

But it's a much more complicated situation than just saying "these guys suck corporate cox and its wikkid geh. Why don't I get teh free wunn?"

A) you don't know the sponsorship deals, so they may not get it for free at all.
B) "Progressive Djenty metal" makes up a much smaller market than all the "signature" fender/squier Gibson/Epiphone guitars, when the aggro marketing is almost identical--but through the radio rather than the youtubes.
C) Getting shit at a discount is awesome--but to the larger point: The people who are good/great at things are subsidized by the people who are not as good/great at the same things. The people who are not as good look to the people who are for equipment advice because, wait for it, they're able to get more out of the gear because they're better at playing/using/whatever. It's a great system for the advancement of technology and gear, and as the demand grows the price drops and/or more affordable options appear so the Joe Schmoes can spend fewer of their dollars to purchase the gear they like.

Advertising is a two way street, and if your ears are perked towards what some NAMM-er is telling you, why not listen?

[MSUsousaphone]

It's even worse for bass players....it's just "hey man, kinda sit here and look gruff while we detune so low we don't need you and you detune so low that only ferrets and elephants can hear you."

[Gearmond]

But it's a much more complicated situation than just saying "these guys suck corporate cox and its wikkid geh. Why don't I get teh free wunn?"

A) you don't know the sponsorship deals, so they may not get it for free at all.
B) "Progressive Djenty metal" makes up a much smaller market than all the "signature" fender/squier Gibson/Epiphone guitars, when the aggro marketing is almost identical--but through the radio rather than the youtubes.
C) Getting shit at a discount is awesome--but to the larger point: The people who are good/great at things are subsidized by the people who are not as good/great at the same things. The people who are not as good look to the people who are for equipment advice because, wait for it, they're able to get more out of the gear because they're better at playing/using/whatever. It's a great system for the advancement of technology and gear, and as the demand grows the price drops and/or more affordable options appear so the Joe Schmoes can spend fewer of their dollars to purchase the gear they like.

Advertising is a two way street, and if your ears are perked towards what some NAMM-er is telling you, why not listen?

except i'm not saying that at all?
A) theres enough videos online by the companies that give them the guitars for free. Tosin Abasi doesn't have a sponsorship with Strandberg, but he most definitely has two guitars by them
B) disagree highly. fender/gibson sig models generally sell to lawyers and dentists who want to play like past legends. this is based on current players
C) except thats only in theory. in execution it just perpetuates the products created, and encourages similar products to be made. if it was a great system for advancing technology, many advancements would be made from WITHIN that sphere. the fact is; thats not how its happened. moreover, they aren;t going to get more out of the gear than what the "average joe" will because the average joe is emulating them and their peers; it is a stagnant pool aside from like one or two dudes. growing demand doesn't reduce the prices for the desirable product, it means the company will make a line of cheaper items that aren't the desirable product

[sonidero]

A) You don't have to buy or watch shit you don't want too...
B) This is getting way to detailed for a thread about gear you don't like...
C) Let all move on to cool gear that we like...

[D.o.S.]

But it's a much more complicated situation than just saying "these guys suck corporate cox and its wikkid geh. Why don't I get teh free wunn?"

A) you don't know the sponsorship deals, so they may not get it for free at all.
B) "Progressive Djenty metal" makes up a much smaller market than all the "signature" fender/squier Gibson/Epiphone guitars, when the aggro marketing is almost identical--but through the radio rather than the youtubes.
C) Getting shit at a discount is awesome--but to the larger point: The people who are good/great at things are subsidized by the people who are not as good/great at the same things. The people who are not as good look to the people who are for equipment advice because, wait for it, they're able to get more out of the gear because they're better at playing/using/whatever. It's a great system for the advancement of technology and gear, and as the demand grows the price drops and/or more affordable options appear so the Joe Schmoes can spend fewer of their dollars to purchase the gear they like.

Advertising is a two way street, and if your ears are perked towards what some NAMM-er is telling you, why not listen?

except i'm not saying that at all?
A) theres enough videos online by the companies that give them the guitars for free. Tosin Abasi doesn't have a sponsorship with Strandberg, but he most definitely has two guitars by them
B) disagree highly. fender/gibson sig models generally sell to lawyers and dentists who want to play like past legends. this is based on current players
C) except thats only in theory. in execution it just perpetuates the products created, and encourages similar products to be made. if it was a great system for advancing technology, many advancements would be made from WITHIN that sphere. the fact is; thats not how its happened. moreover, they aren;t going to get more out of the gear than what the "average joe" will because the average joe is emulating them and their peers; it is a stagnant pool aside from like one or two dudes. growing demand doesn't reduce the prices for the desirable product, it means the company will make a line of cheaper items that aren't the desirable product

You don't think that the average consumer has more access to more options at more price ranges than they did twenty years ago? And that the average guitar is manufactured to a higher level of quality?

Are doctors and lawyers buying the Pete Wentz Squier Sig?

Did Alembic not come to pass by dealing with The Dead and Jack Casady?

[zRobertez]

the only electric guitar I've ever owned (not basses and not my mom's boyfriend's) was $250. It was a pretty lucky deal.
And I know what you mean about that djenty stuff. Like half of the music scene is my town falls under that category. And they all have multiples of the same gear. But some of them are cool and a few are close friends of mine. But they tend to drool over the same gear.
But I don't think that's too dissimilar from all of us drooling over fuck ods and delays with 10+ knobs.
I've strayed a little from the op anyway

[Mudfuzz]

I say meh.

If you are sheeple enough to buy gear because a guitar hero told you so, or a add told you so or that you feel you need to fit in the you got what you deserved.

Rule #1 buy things you like
Rule #2 don't the things you don't
Rule #3 don't rape the pandas

[Achtane]

Rule #3 don't rape the pandas

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSOwEfuhIpY[/youtube]

[Gearmond]

You don't think that the average consumer has more access to more options at more price ranges than they did twenty years ago? And that the average guitar is manufactured to a higher level of quality?

Are doctors and lawyers buying the Pete Wentz Squier Sig?

Did Alembic not come to pass by dealing with The Dead and Jack Casady?

thats for a different reason imo. like its just because the technology has increased regardless of the guitar industry.

cherrypicked example

[Gearmond]

But I don't think that's too dissimilar from all of us drooling over fuck ods and delays with 10+ knobs.
I've strayed a little from the op anyway

to be fair, most of us GENERALLY like shit that actually ADDS to the functionality of the delay, fuzz, etc. or actually sounds really different. aside from some of the more well off dudes, i don't think many of us have two ponies that do the same trick, so to speak.

i mean we can TOTALLY go there, but overall I feel the gear each of us owns is more like... utilitarian and eclectic.

[dubkitty]

from my perspective as the Old Guy, the marketplace has been pretty homogenized since the late 1980s, when the Eddie Van Halen style of shred guitar came to popularity and the Roland MIDI guitar and Steinberger died a death. ever since then there were generally three options: Fender or Fender-esque, Gibson (by which i really mean Les Pauls) or Gibson-esque, and shredder (which came to include the weirder Gibson shapes like the V and Explorer). i actually think that there are more options now than there were for many years, what with the aluminum-neck makers, FMIC's revitalization of Gretsch and now Guild, the reissuing of rare Epiuphones like the mini-humbucker Wilshire, and the various odd small-builder guitars at reasonable prices e.g. DiPinto.

i don't disagree with the intent of the OP, but try to remember that the A7/Opeth/Mustaine/Kirk/Petrucci/etc. market, as someone said above, essentially subsidizes the interesting parts of the major manufacturer's lines and gives e.g. FMIC the economic space to take the flyer they're current on with the new Guild electrics. people have always followed fashion...look at the number of UK/Continental guitarists in the early 70s who played white Strats in emulation of Hendrix' last tour. it's deliberately driven by the signature models thing now, which i also dislike personally...i wouldn't play a Peter Green LP copy. but i don't mind a sunburst LP, you know? the thing i think is particularly weird is the Paul Gilbert flanger...what's the point of a flanger button that's essentially one guy's party trick?