Mudfuzz wrote:neonblack wrote:Fair enough. I entertain the idea that aliens exist.
Are we talking intelligent or like anything at all? Microbial life seems much more realistic.
from a statistical point of view I think sure, possible but as for the they are visiting and probing us.. no sorry I lived in Sedona.. had to meet many people that thought they were walk-in and people that saw stuff and were abducted and probed… and I think a lot can be said for drugs and wishful thinking...
^^^This, except for the Sedona part.
The current estimate for the number of galaxies in the observable universe is now around 2 trillion.
http://www.nasa.gov/feature/goddard/201 ... ly-thought
Every galaxy has tens of millions to trillions of stars. So, statistically it seems impossible that we are alone in the universe, not to mention decidedly non-Copernican.
Iommic Pope wrote:bloatedsack wrote:Iommic Pope wrote:
I agree, with the exception of contact.
There's a fair chance that anyone more advanced than ourselves that had survived the filters we have no before us may be actively "blacking out" the!efforts we make to communicate.
Look at our own world for an example. There were plenty of "lost" tribes in the world, but even when outsiders try to not to influence them we do. You're suggesting that we're at the "cargo cult" stage of alien interaction? Then we'd still have more something to prove contact.
In other examples, once the "outside" discovers a lost group of people, we go in and fuck with them. It might be minimal, but we still do it enough to influence and make it clear that we (outsiders) exist.
If there were aliens bopping around Earth, there'd be signs. We don't need them to land a craft at Devil's Tower and swap ambassadors, but there'd be something. We've got enough people looking into the sky, enough radio antennas picking up everything, and enough interest that if there were aliens here, I suspect we'd know
something more.
It's a nice idea, but I don't think it's happened. It's a big universe, and I simply don't think we've stumbled over each othe ryet.
Agreed, I don't think it's happened, let's be clear on that.
But your biggest flaw here is that you are comparing what we do to a Type 3 level of advancement.
Alien behaviour and psychology, particularly one far, far more advanced than ours, may not resemble our own in any way, shape or form.
There are a lot of interesting, unanswered questions on what it would take to evolve to Type 3. For example, what are the limits of evolutionary development? If you look at the convergence rates of genetic algorithms, for example, they converge logarithmically. So, by this point in our evolution, have we made all of the major evolutionary gains there are to be made?
Also, what other limitations do the laws of biology place on the development of intelligent species? For example, considering life as we know it, do the laws of biology allow reptiles to develop intelligence, or are they universally constrained to be lower life forms? Are there other life forms that can develop intelligence, under Earth-like conditions, that we just don't have here? And if we expect life to develop under conditions similar to Earth, why not?
I believe our future is to more or less become cyborgs. People would now rather just look things up on the internet than learn them, and bio implants are becoming more sophisticated. Soon everyone will want enhancements. But, we still don't know the limitations of artificial intelligence or physiology, either.
Which raises another question, what are the limits of genetic engineering? Can we go beyond our biological limitations, say design our babies to have (purely biological) intelligence that could not evolve naturally, and if so, who will have access to this technology? Will those with access to the technology program themselves for ethical behavior, or will they simply enslave or exterminate everyone else?
Will we become the Borg?
