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Dungus wrote:

Disarm D'arcy wrote: /rant

Things like the headscarf ban and Charlie Hebdo, the story about the mayor wanting to ban Islam from France etc., give these cowardly extremists a reason to target Paris.

They'll do it no matter what.

Hello my friends, I just wanted to add to ddy's quote of French constitution that the Bastards definitely hate us for what we are and not what we do, that includes:

- we party with people from everywhere (they shot and killed French, European, Americans and Africans alike Last night),
- we party with girls, and they haven't had the chance to touch a nipple or lick a meat candy in their entire life,
- we feel that we should offer shelter to migrants instead of closing our borders.

Yesterday Paris was pretty miserable and fearful but fuck yeah, today the weather is sunny, Parisians were sunbathing having they Sunday glass of wine with their friends but earlier than usual because the swimming pool and gym were closed.

I just lived a kilometer away from the Bataclan and I can tell you the kids won't stop breathing their mother's cigarette smoke soon.

Thank you for your Ilf support ! Fluctuat nec mergitur.

Word! Glad to hear spirits are high.

Re: political highjacking, on FB, posts hijacking vs. posts simply expressing condolences is, like, a solid 3:1 ratio.

Nobody can keep their shit out of it.

goroth wrote:Dogmatic atheists are just as bad as dogmatic theists.

ehhh. Atheists don't have a doctrine or text from which they read that tells them to kill believers or non-atheists. There are atheists that like to put it in people's faces. People need to call out a lot of the absurdities within religions for what they are: absurdities.

Steko made a good point on this page.

Faldoe wrote:Maajid Nawaz offers a good explanation here:

http://insider.foxnews.com/2015/11/14/e ... insurgency

Again, people should watch this, and not dismiss it right off the bat because it is on Fox and Friends. I'm not a fan but the guest is legit and makes good points.

casecandy wrote:Re: political highjacking, on FB, posts hijacking vs. posts simply expressing condolences is, like, a solid 3:1 ratio.

Nobody can keep their shit out of it.

This shit will just keep happening - the killings. You can't be neutral on a moving train. This is about politics and world views and why they attacked France.

I dunno, I think dogmatic atheists have the odd texts.

I've read every book by Dawkins, Harris, Hitchens, and a few by Dennett.

I see them as quite balanced and multifaceted works.

But I know people who quote those books in a very one-sided way, and I wouldn't hesitate to use the word hijacking here... much like fundies quoting the Bible or the Koran are necessarily cherrypicking those texts, as well.

Like, even The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins is a really fascinating book, nuanced, full of cool tangents, but I know people who just foam at the mouth with quotes from this book, all the time, using it to support arguments for things like forced deportation of Muslims and shit... I'm like, did we read the same book?!

Also... people often say there are no atheist terrorists, but that isn't necessarily true...? For example, in school shooting after school shooting, we hear a survivor tell some variant of the story, "He asked the victim to stand up, asked her, 'Are you a Christian?,' she said, 'Yes,' and he shot her in the head." That happened at Columbine and also much more recently. The media calls it a lone wolf, but is it not atheist terrorism?

I don't have an agenda, I'm legitimately posing the question.

casecandy wrote:I dunno, I think dogmatic atheists have the odd texts.

I've read every book by Dawkins, Harris, Hitchens, and a few by Dennett.

I see them as quite balanced and multifaceted works.

But I know people who quote those books in a very one-sided way, and I wouldn't hesitate to use the word hijacking here... much like fundies quoting the Bible or the Koran are necessarily cherrypicking those texts, as well.

Like, even The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins is a really fascinating book, nuanced, full of cool tangents, but I know people who just foam at the mouth with quotes from this book, all the time, using it to support arguments for things like forced deportation of Muslims and shit... I'm like, did we read the same book?!

Also... people often say there are no atheist terrorists, but that isn't necessarily true...? For example, in school shooting after school shooting, we hear a survivor tell some variant of the story, "He asked the victim to stand up, asked her, 'Are you a Christian?,' she said, 'Yes,' and he shot her in the head." That happened at Columbine and also much more recently. The media calls it a lone wolf, but is it not atheist terrorism?

I don't have an agenda, I'm legitimately posing the question.

I haven't read any of Dawkin's books. Only Harris and some Dennett. I've listened to a lot of Dawkins talks and I know people can seize certain information to parade around gleefully that god doesn't exist and are 100% certain about it. I'm more with Harris in that he says he is an atheist in terms of how God is put forth in religious texts - that those texts are the word of God, etc. In that sense, I don't believe that God exists.

Thee difference with shooters/killers that say their are atheist and kill other people - ask them their religion, and religious fundamentalists killing people is that atheists have no text or set of beliefs that tells them to do that to people. So the atheist killer is more a killer that happens to be an atheist in that the latter has no codified external influence on his or her actions other than their own warped view of what an atheist is or should be.

Someone could make the argument about a fundamentalist muslim - that they are reading the text wrong, but if the Koran is the word of God, nothing in it can be wrong and so a literal interpretation is the way to read it and it clearly states to kill non-believers.

Agreeing that this is not the time but admitting to adding to the hypocrisy of saying this and I don't mean to offend but some random thoughts that pop up immediately on your de-railment...

I think the issue here again has NOTHING to do with religion. People are fucking crazy despite religion. They use it as a scape goat to claim they are justified in their actions. It disgusts me that people on social media are likening this to other incidents that are not even close to the same or that they are saying "well it's because of Syria or it's because of religion". Give me a fucking break. It's because of crazy. Their brains are insane. They don't value human life. It has nothing to do with religion as a whole or otherwise. People just use these types of incidents for their own sick fuck delusions.

The people of France need our support just like the people of Syria did. Just like the people of Iraq did, just like the people in many other nations have. We live in a sick fucking world. It's sad. I'm just glad those bastards didn't get anyone else. I'm sure they had way more planned than they accomplished. I feel so bad for the families of the fallen and I hope to God they are all able to cope somehow with what has happened. It's such a horrible tragedy.

We must pull together in this time and eliminate the enemy who is declaring war on all our nations. ISIS must be stopped. It's not political. I don't have an agenda. I just don't want anymore of my fellow man or woman to die because of these murderous pieces of shit.

If I could, I'd enlist just to go fight those motherfuckers.

My heart is with you guys. It really is.

It is MIND BOGGLING to me that people can say this has nothing to do with religion. Absolutely mind boggling.

I think jwar is still carb deprived. Needs more French bread in his diet.

repoman wrote:It is MIND BOGGLING to me that people can say this has nothing to do with religion. Absolutely mind boggling.

it's called denial. It is fact that "religion"+politics+commerce are the roots of all these problems and have been for millennia. And adding more religion+politics+commerce i.e. more war/troops/violence in the name of/against will only continue the current path. We need new ideas, the old ones have not worked yet, there has/will always be a victim which will create more hate, more violence, more tragedy.

repoman wrote:It is MIND BOGGLING to me that people can say this has nothing to do with religion. Absolutely mind boggling.

Yeah Jwar you're 110% wrong on this. Not to say that people wouldn't behave this way in the absence of religion (you can take a gander at a lot of the Cold War era atheist countries to start with) but this sort of insane fanaticism comes out especially when religion is involved. The only meaningful difference between ISIS/ISIL and the crazed fundies in Arkansas or whatever is the budget and the scope of their territory.

However! The really fucked up part about the last couple months of ISIS-y terrorism (and no I'm not talking about the drummer from Pelican here) is that it marks a pretty serious shift from the "we're just building a caliphate over here bros" sort of rhetoric there were espousing for a long time.