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Re: OMG, I fuckin' hate politics!

Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2016 2:20 pm
by Mudfuzz
snipelfritz wrote:
Mudfuzz wrote:
snipelfritz wrote:Obama third term? What are you people talking about? Did you hit your head?
hbombgraphics wrote:The Two party system has failed and our Country is too divided to realize it.

I feel like this is intentional, that both party has made it impossible for anyone supporting them to find middle ground.

I also think that these two candidates are a reflection of the people, which is just fucking sad.
So it's all the parties' design that these candidates are so unpopular and they are both struggling to keep their respective bases together?

I'm sick of stupid conspiracy theories, ideas of design, the word "truth" and basically anything else that tries to create some grand illusion of control. Nothing is controlled. Nothing is to blame. No one has any idea or care what they're doing to the big picture. Every politician, every member of "the media", every activist, every voter is just some shlup who wakes up and reacts to today's new stimuli in the name of self preservation.
Yes but then we have to accept that we are all lemmings and find that cliff and swim off into the sea.
No, we have to accept there is no cliff.
Image

snipelfritz wrote:Can we acknowledge the fact that CNN has spent all day covering almost a dozen women coming out saying that Donny has groped them and his response has been "well just look at them." And shooting down other superficial details with "well I'm so great, I wouldn't be in that situation."
I still find it funny you think there is any kind of competence in tv news :lol:

Re: OMG, I fuckin' hate politics!

Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2016 2:53 pm
by Seance
One of the problems is that Presidential elections are usually won or lost on domestic issues,
and usually both candidates agree about 85-100% on a foreign policy centered around perpetuating
war-crimes and facilitating corporate malfeasance through military intervention on a global scale
(shedding blood in order to keep the price of oil artificially low, toppling governments or propping
up "business-friendly" dictatorships, etc.). So all candidates will try their best not to bring up
foreign policy at all during the election cycle, because for the most part they don't want people
to actually express an opinion about or vote on US foreign policy.

Obama did say that he would end the war in Iraq and close Guantanamo. He hasn't done either.
But the thing is that he can't do either without the congress and senate, and since senators
and congresspeople campaign and fund-raise perpetually, they are afraid to turn off their constituents
by ending the ongoing war crimes instituted by Bush and maintained by Obama. The tactics of the
drone war (including assassinating US citizens) cedes the moral high ground and isn't likely to stop
the tactics of asymmetrical warfare utilized either by pure psychopaths or religious zealots.

So the problem is that US citizens who take the time and bother to vote are usually highly concerned
about domestic policy and often unaware of US foreign policy and totally ignorant of the actual actions
of the US government.

In order to impact US foreign policy a voter needs to not only vote for presidential, congressional and
senate candidates during election time, they also have to lobby their own government advising them
to follow international law and to live up to the professed ideals of America (democracy, freedom of
thought and expression, adherence to basic human rights and international law). The problem is that
most citizens are so busy living life and/or trying to make a living that they can't spend all their time
lobbying the government about US foreign policy. Which is why corporations dictate US foreign policy.
They can afford to have full-time lobbyists. And they spend a lot of money trying to
downplay, water down or silence the impact of the vote.

If "corporations are people too", shouldn't that mean that corporations lose their vote if they're convicted
of a felony, like happens to US citizens? If a bank commits a felony they pay a tiny fee and move on.
But shouldn't they be prevented from lobbying or contributing to SuperPACs if they commit felonious fraud?
The same should apply to corporations that knowingly pollute or poison the environment.

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:35 pm
by Chankgeez
(Good post, Seance.)

I think Donald J. Trump himself has rigged this election.

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:55 pm
by Inconuucl
The Internet as a whole has, really. It's the spread of mass echo chambers brought by the rapid increase of Internet usage. The same thing happened on Obama's first term where he used the internet in a move very reminiscent of the early part of the 1960's elections, where Nixon was outmaneuvered by Kennedy's use of television.

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2016 9:01 pm
by jrfox92
Inconuucl wrote:The Internet as a whole has, really. It's the spread of mass echo chambers brought by the rapid increase of Internet usage. The same thing happened on Obama's first term where he used the internet in a move very reminiscent of the early part of the 1960's elections, where Nixon was outmaneuvered by Kennedy's use of television.
So what you're saying is... Trump is white Obama.

edit:shut the fuck up, D.o.S.

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2016 9:15 pm
by D.o.S.
jrfox92 wrote:
Inconuucl wrote:The Internet as a whole has, really. It's the spread of mass echo chambers brought by the rapid increase of Internet usage. The same thing happened on Obama's first term where he used the internet in a move very reminiscent of the early part of the 1960's elections, where Nixon was outmaneuvered by Kennedy's use of television.
So what your saying is... Trump is white Obama.
:p


Anyway, to the point:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/ryan-holi ... 31962.html

Good story with a good/click-worthy headline, but the upshot of:
It’s those last few points that are most interesting to me—in fact, they point to a fundamental reality of the internet. Not only does research show that anger is the most viral and provocative emotion—meaning that angry Trump supporters are going to be far more active than a resigned Clinton voter—but silence is often misinterpreted. Going back to what one programmer defined as Warnock’s Dilemma, it’s very hard to know what to make of a lack of response. The media’s typical reaction is to cater to active audiences. If something is being shared, they cover it more. There is no positive sign of people simply nodding their head and moving on—a common reaction to common sense, middle of the road content—so there is no way to skate to that puck. By definition, normal, reasonable people are not an audience you can pander to.

In the same way that no amount of media fawning makes HBO’s Girls more popular than The Big Bang Theory, no amount of Trump media coverage changes his fundamental demographic issues. It has been the inability of his now alt-right driven campaign to realize this that doomed him from truly capitalizing on voter’s real desire for change. It’s what makes his most recent debate performance irrelevant. He landed plenty of punches on Hillary...but it pleased the crowd and not the referee-like undecided voters he needed so desperately to add to his base.

Yes, it seems like there are huge amounts of Trump supporters out there. They are by definition louder and more motivated. They are naturally more compelling to cover. They are also engaged—or complicit—in forms of manipulation designed to create the sense of a movement which can’t be stopped. Clinton hides from media coverage and doesn’t make herself available even to be interviewed. Both approaches create feedback loops in which support for the former appears greater than support for the latter, because one is vocal and loud while the other is implicit and begins and ends at the ballot box.
Is important to keep in mind.

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2016 9:51 pm
by jrfox92
D.o.S. wrote:
jrfox92 wrote:
Inconuucl wrote:The Internet as a whole has, really. It's the spread of mass echo chambers brought by the rapid increase of Internet usage. The same thing happened on Obama's first term where he used the internet in a move very reminiscent of the early part of the 1960's elections, where Nixon was outmaneuvered by Kennedy's use of television.
So what your saying is... Trump is white Obama.
:p
Image
:picard:
This is probably the first time I've done that in years.
YEARS.

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2016 10:57 pm
by D.o.S.
It's a brutal feeling, isn't it? :lol:

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2016 11:34 pm
by popvulture
D.o.S. wrote:It's a brutal feeling, isn't it? :lol:
Dude it sucks so bad. HATE it when I do that kind of thing... the other day I typed "to" instead of "too."

The pain.

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2016 11:55 pm
by Inconuucl
jrfox92 wrote:
Inconuucl wrote:The Internet as a whole has, really. It's the spread of mass echo chambers brought by the rapid increase of Internet usage. The same thing happened on Obama's first term where he used the internet in a move very reminiscent of the early part of the 1960's elections, where Nixon was outmaneuvered by Kennedy's use of television.
So what you're saying is... Trump is white Obama.

edit:shut the fuck up, D.o.S.
Oh god, I forgot to type the entire point of my post. :lol:

Where I was going with this is that this time it's the public that's collectively sabotaging the election through hacking and echo chamber rhetoric. Like, thanks to the internet smaller (and more radical) groups that would have not had as much reach are getting national attention because the internet makes them so much louder.

Trump is using this to his advantage, whether he's fully conscious of it or not.

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Mon Oct 17, 2016 12:18 am
by D.o.S.
I know people glaze over my real posts but there's at least some compelling evidence that that isn't the case.

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Mon Oct 17, 2016 12:52 am
by jrfox92
Inconuucl wrote:Like, thanks to the internet smaller (and more radical) groups that would have not had as much reach are getting national attention because the internet makes them so much louder.
D.o.S. wrote:I know people glaze over my real posts but there's at least some compelling evidence that that isn't the case.
Um...
Image

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Mon Oct 17, 2016 8:51 am
by D.o.S.
That guy.

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Mon Oct 17, 2016 9:22 am
by rustywire
D.o.S. wrote:That that guy.

Re: I think I know who "rigged" this election...

Posted: Mon Oct 17, 2016 9:31 am
by Jwar
Do you think it's possible to make the ballot box implode by trying to put Hillary and Trump at the same time? Perhaps it would them to implode as well???