Occupy Wallstreet

[CaptainWampum]

Does anyone really think MACING PEOPLE IN THE FACE IS A GOOD WAY TO RESOLVE THIS ISSUE? It doesn't fucking matter if they weren't on the sidewalk or if they were pushing up against a barrier, that cop walked up to a small group of unarmed women and MACED THEM IN THE FACE. Police retaliation should NEVER take the violence to the next level. The idea is to STOP things getting out of hand, not spreading fear and pushing people until they don't know what to other than FIGHT to survive. The only direction this can go is full scale revolution if things keep being pushed like this. I don't want to see that happen. I'm going to assume I'm far from the most furious person in this country right now, and that being the case, these people will EXPLODE if change doesn't happen, hell, if things don't just keep getting WORSE. I can't bear to see this country go this direction, I honesty feel like I'm watching the apocalypse happen before my eyes.

[D.o.S.]

Does anyone really think MACING PEOPLE IN THE FACE IS A GOOD WAY TO RESOLVE THIS ISSUE? It doesn't fucking matter if they weren't on the sidewalk or if they were pushing up against a barrier, that cop walked up to a small group of unarmed women and MACED THEM IN THE FACE. Police retaliation should NEVER take the violence to the next level. The idea is to STOP things getting out of hand, not spreading fear and pushing people until they don't know what to other than FIGHT to survive. The only direction this can go is full scale revolution if things keep being pushed like this. I don't want to see that happen. I'm going to assume I'm far from the most furious person in this country right now, and that being the case, these people will EXPLODE if change doesn't happen, hell, if things don't just keep getting WORSE. I can't bear to see this country go this direction, I honesty feel like I'm watching the apocalypse happen before my eyes.

Nope, sorry, you're just incorrect.

People aren't going to explode, because the limits of reform haven't been reached. Only once those limits are hit, then you'll see what you're talking about.

And you probably won't see it then. Most people don't give a shit, and that's not likely to change because some one got maced in the face. A) It doesn't bother John Doe in any immediate fashion, B) The protesters aren't actually doing anything constructive, C) it's much easier to keep your head down and go to work.

We've got a long way to go before anyone other than a pissed off black flagger is going to do anything, and we're further still from any meaningful change coming out of this.

[Bellyheart]

That attitude perpetuates pessimism. I'm pretty sure inspiration is coming pretty strong off these protest that keep happening. I don't believe people are gonna make anything happen overnight but its gotta start somewhere, sometime. Why not now?

[wsas3]

That attitude perpetuates pessimism. I'm pretty sure inspiration is coming pretty strong off these protest that keep happening. I don't believe people are gonna make anything happen overnight but its gotta start somewhere, sometime. Why not now?

Awaiting D.O.S.' blunt nihilistic response

[D.o.S.]

That attitude perpetuates pessimism. I'm pretty sure inspiration is coming pretty strong off these protest that keep happening. I don't believe people are gonna make anything happen overnight but its gotta start somewhere, sometime. Why not now?

Because I'm not a fifteen year old high on my first Rage Against The Machine record.

If I have to, I'll flex my left wing bona fides, but suffice it to say that it has been my experience and research that leads me to say the best way to bring about change is to educate people and be inclusive in the process, not by running around shouting really loudly.

You know what most of those people in that video want to do? Go to work. The cop presence, which is brought on by the people protesting, is a distraction to them and will make them look down on whatever the cause of the protesters is, even if they'd otherwise disagree with it.

There are some people who say that waiting for fence sitters is silly. But you need to have a popular movement: a.k.a. something that's supported by more than a few angry extremists. And you need to do it in a way that draws attention to you in a positive way, not by simply camping out and waiting for whatever to happen. You need to do things in such a way that popular culture, and by extension the large media outlets, can't just write you off as crazy, or worse: straight up ignore you.

Establish the debate on your terms, and do it in such a way that the bystanders have no choice but to pick a side. You want it to be yours. Do that without being coercive, and you've got yourself a movement.


Lastly, always make sure you soak your bandanna in vinegar.

[Bellyheart]

Holy shit, that was Rage wasn't it...weird...coincidence Morello voiced his support?

I'm tired of what's happening and am more than open to supporting anyone trying to make a change that only represents a quarter of what I believe, instead of these people who are so unaware of real life and drowning in wealth they don't know what it is to struggle or live check to check. Strength in numbers. Solidarity. Optimism. If people want something different you have to believe it's possible. Being cynical will get you nowhere and is extremely unproductive.

If you guys come up with an idea for this cause I am just as game. However, I feel your constant pessimism and long-winded tangents generalizing people for their appearance are extremely counter-productive and a big part of the problem with "most people" which you speak of...

I'm not the most rehearsed in all the issues amongst the country/world/people, but I'm aware that I'm unhappy with things generally and have over-compromised myself, by accepting "that's just the way it is..." for an answer, way too many times. It doesn't have to be the way it is if everyone living under that rule doesn't like it. Strength by numbers.

[D.o.S.]

You might want to reread my post.

I'm not pessimistic, or cynical. I'm just more down with Abbie Hoffman than ELF-types.

[Christopher]

Does anyone really think MACING PEOPLE IN THE FACE IS A GOOD WAY TO RESOLVE THIS ISSUE? It doesn't fucking matter if they weren't on the sidewalk or if they were pushing up against a barrier, that cop walked up to a small group of unarmed women and MACED THEM IN THE FACE. Police retaliation should NEVER take the violence to the next level. The idea is to STOP things getting out of hand, not spreading fear and pushing people until they don't know what to other than FIGHT to survive. The only direction this can go is full scale revolution if things keep being pushed like this. I don't want to see that happen. I'm going to assume I'm far from the most furious person in this country right now, and that being the case, these people will EXPLODE if change doesn't happen, hell, if things don't just keep getting WORSE. I can't bear to see this country go this direction, I honesty feel like I'm watching the apocalypse happen before my eyes.

people won't explode, there will be no revolution. the days of patriotism are over. there is no reason to fight and protest to fix a society that will quit caring about you as soon as the new iphone comes out. the best form of revolt for someone who is truly sick of the way this country operates is to migrate to a place that better suits your political/social/economic views. contribute to their gdp instead of the US.

[Bellyheart]

I wrote that before you submitted that...but didn't feel like editing it so I just added that first part. Agreed on the Hoffman vs ELF...but overall I think most people want the same in the end, just a different direction and if this opens up a gap then other people can plow on into it.

....watching football...

[D.o.S.]

If this opens up discourse, I'm all for it.

Whether or not it will remains to be seen. My guess is that it gets whitewashed as people say "look at those crazy protesters."

The important thing is that it needs to be a discussion, not a pair of opposite poles shouting at each other through megaphones.

[snipelfritz]

The only good protesting does these days is it lets us figure out which chicks smoke weed and put out.

[wsas3]

a pair of opposite poles shouting at each other through megaphones.

=politics

[devnulljp]

[McSpunckle]

Someone's going to have to explain a couple of things to me.

The words "socialist" and "anarchist" are being used interchangeably. They're not even sort of the same thing.

The "nobody cares what 50 socialists say" comment... where did that number come from? There were over 1000 people protesting. It just doesn't get a lot of coverage because, frankly, the media doesn't give a shit about liberals.

And finally, how is it OK to just mace a group of people? t's not like one person tried to get through and they got her-- the dude maced a whole group. He even got a couple of the cops, and the cops looked confused. A couple of the protesters were very obviously just standing there. They weren't preventing the cops from "doing their jobs." At worse they were yelling at them.

[devnulljp]

Someone's going to have to explain a couple of things to me.
The words "socialist" and "anarchist" are being used interchangeably. They're not even sort of the same thing.

Americans Socialism = "anything I do not like"
There is no deeper understanding of what the word may mean, as well as a hysterical fear to look into it any deeper too.

They weren't preventing the cops from "doing their jobs." At worse they were yelling at them.

Cops' job is to be shocktroops for big money. Always has been, always will be.