ILF4LYF
http://ilovefuzz.com/
The Covenant, the Sword, and the Arm of the Lord. The rhymingest hate group of the 1980s.Faldoe wrote: The CSA is the Cross, the Sword, and the Arm (?). Google it.
Thinking about Trump and/or Clinton doesn't spoil your appetite?gnomethrone wrote:Ugh the name of this thread just makes me crave plantanos and poutine. And then I click and remember it's not about food.
I realised upon re-reading that that was one of the most poorly constructed sentences I'd ever put together.Faldoe wrote:(1) - Does it have to be one of the other? It would make sense because they are so hell-bent on enacting their vision that they would use propaganda, as well as it being a necessity since they feel some much of the world is blind - willfully or otherwise - to God's true message and are thus living sinful lives.Iommic Pope wrote:Re Isis and publicity: (1) they either think they're spreading a holy message or pumping out propaganda. The fact they are very good/selective about what content does both to which audience is just business these days.
This may seem reductive but I don't honestly believe the assholes smart enough to try and engineer this idea of a caliphate into existence aren't any different from or better than your garden variety despot/dictator/warlord. Faith is a lever, but the game remains mostly the same.
They want the same things. To get fat, remain fat, and not have to do any physical labour.
Which is why religion was invented in the first place.
Certainly it's all similar since war and religion - everything we do as humans - takes place on the human stage and seeking power is part of it. And thus warlords and dictators use similar types of manipulation and violence against those that resist. It seems as though such a response as yours kind of suggests a "well, all evil people do it, so...?" The point is that there seems to be an immense downplaying of how Islam, and many of it's adherents - look at the call for Sharia in the UK - want something that is incompatible with common sense values in the 21st century.
I agree that kind of backwardness and unreason it's isolated to Islam. Christian certainly has similar intolerances and are being played out like in Uganda with the heavy anti-gay sentiment there, and the calls for death to gay people.
Tell it to Matthew Sheppard and George Tiller. Oh, right, you can't. Why is that again? The distinction between Christianists and Islamists is not quite as big as you want it to be.Faldoe wrote:You had me till the bolded portion. There are plenty of Christians that believe being gay is a sin but still live within the boundaries of law and semi-reason despite being an idiot when it comes to being gay. That is not the case for ISIS as well as many in the Muslim world. I do think there are those - perhaps more than people in the west may know - in the middle east that are not as extreme in their views towards gays, women, etc. but that can't speak their true feelings for fear of reprisal. My point being that there is a kind of clash of civilizations going on. I realize and appreciate how people can overly simply that and bring it down to a "America is perfect and the greatest, fuccckkk teeeerrr, everywhere else is shit," which isn't helpful and not what I believe.D.o.S. wrote:Oh, yeah, I agree with you -- I don't think any of the three major Middle Eastern religions are 'religions of peace (or piece)', and I also agree that there are a lot of people who are willing to conflate Islam (and Christianity) with ethnicity, which is equally appalling, I just think that anything that talks about 'the fundamental nature of Islam' is usually just more fuel for some arbitrary 'clash of civilizations' nonsense when the reality is that people of all stripes and locales are simply attempting to have everyone behave according to some arbitrary social mores from 1200+ years ago. The only difference comes with familiarity, IMO.
The calls for Sharia in the UK as just as laughable as the calls for outlawing abortion in the US, right -- and that's part of the reason why France, which has a notable record of enforced secularity, has become such a target for Islamic fundamentalists in recent years. I think you have to treat all of these assholes like the assholes they are, regardless of which folks they're praying to.
Which means we have to fuck them. We have to fuck those assholes. All of them.
I also don't know how we can have a frank discussion about such a divide without it ultimately being perceived as something so simplistic which the clash of civilizations - as a rhetorical tool - is not utilized as such.
I think the banning of head coverings in France is a little foolish but I don't think blaming France's hyper secularism is the answer. Christians and Muslims may both be idiots for believing different and similar myths but their actions in the world - which come from their beliefs - aren't equally the same. Look at Arab Christians in the Middle east. Are they blowing themselves up? No. In many respects they have experienced similar hardships as their Arab Muslim neighbors yet don't act out the same way, and thats because of their core belief/ideological view of the world.
I don't think the anti-Abortion stuff is the same as Sharia. While I'm pro-abortion - or the right to have one - I can see peoples' points to being against it. Also people that oppose abortion fall into various camps - those that want to ban it all together and those that want to ban federal funding going towards it. If I were a Christian or someone that opposed abortion, I could see the point in being against one's money - tax payer dollars - being used to fund an act you found morally reprehensible. While being anti-abortion, such a person still seems to agree with the rest of the bill of rights and freedoms of their fellow citizens - to be religious, or not. That a women can wear shorts and a shirt with some cleavage - if she wants.
Sharia allows for none of that and also includes death for leaving Islam, stoning adulterers, etc. and Sharia is something that is all encompassing to life and society. So while I don't agree with the anti-abortion crowd, comparing them to Sharia advocates isn't even.
Speaking of "you had me until the bolded portion" there is literally no proof that the majority of Muslims sympathize with this, the same way there's no proof that the majority of Christians sympathize with their gay hating friends or folks who advocate for the killing of baby killers, if you will.Faldoe wrote:You had me till the bolded portion. There are plenty of Christians that believe being gay is a sin but still live within the boundaries of law and semi-reason despite being an idiot when it comes to being gay. That is not the case for ISIS as well as many in the Muslim world. I do think there are those - perhaps more than people in the west may know - in the middle east that are not as extreme in their views towards gays, women, etc. but that can't speak their true feelings for fear of reprisal. My point being that there is a kind of clash of civilizations going on. I realize and appreciate how people can overly simply that and bring it down to a "America is perfect and the greatest, fuccckkk teeeerrr, everywhere else is shit," which isn't helpful and not what I believe.D.o.S. wrote:Oh, yeah, I agree with you -- I don't think any of the three major Middle Eastern religions are 'religions of peace (or piece)', and I also agree that there are a lot of people who are willing to conflate Islam (and Christianity) with ethnicity, which is equally appalling, I just think that anything that talks about 'the fundamental nature of Islam' is usually just more fuel for some arbitrary 'clash of civilizations' nonsense when the reality is that people of all stripes and locales are simply attempting to have everyone behave according to some arbitrary social mores from 1200+ years ago. The only difference comes with familiarity, IMO.
The calls for Sharia in the UK as just as laughable as the calls for outlawing abortion in the US, right -- and that's part of the reason why France, which has a notable record of enforced secularity, has become such a target for Islamic fundamentalists in recent years. I think you have to treat all of these assholes like the assholes they are, regardless of which folks they're praying to.
Which means we have to fuck them. We have to fuck those assholes. All of them.
I also don't know how we can have a frank discussion about such a divide without it ultimately being perceived as something so simplistic which the clash of civilizations - as a rhetorical tool - is not utilized as such.
I think the banning of head coverings in France is a little foolish but I don't think blaming France's hyper secularism is the answer. Christians and Muslims may both be idiots for believing different and similar myths but their actions in the world - which come from their beliefs - aren't equally the same. Look at Arab Christians in the Middle east. Are they blowing themselves up? No. In many respects they have experienced similar hardships as their Arab Muslim neighbors yet don't act out the same way, and thats because of their core belief/ideological view of the world.
I don't think the anti-Abortion stuff is the same as Sharia. While I'm pro-abortion - or the right to have one - I can see peoples' points to being against it. Also people that oppose abortion fall into various camps - those that want to ban it all together and those that want to ban federal funding going towards it. If I were a Christian or someone that opposed abortion, I could see the point in being against one's money - tax payer dollars - being used to fund an act you found morally reprehensible. While being anti-abortion, such a person still seems to agree with the rest of the bill of rights and freedoms of their fellow citizens - to be religious, or not. That a women can wear shorts and a shirt with some cleavage - if she wants.
Sharia allows for none of that and also includes death for leaving Islam, stoning adulterers, etc. and Sharia is something that is all encompassing to life and society. So while I don't agree with the anti-abortion crowd, comparing them to Sharia advocates isn't even.
jwar wrote:I guess I see what you're saying now. I literally didn't understand the comparison. Thanks for the clarification homie.