ilovefuzz.com

jwar wrote:Dude. ILF. Don't do it bro. DON'T DO IT! Must never stop fuzzing!!!!

I've still got dirt and fuzz. When I say "breather" I mean from buying.

John wrote:Aka another classic Devi Ever move, and I'm sorry to say this but a stereotypical trans person move. I support anyone's need to reassign themselves to the gender they are most comfortable with, but there seems to be a common strain of self-absorbed melodrama and constant dissatisfaction among the trans people I've encountered. I guess it is a symptom of the disorientation, sadness and confusion that seems to come with their conditions, but it doesn't help the cause.

edited to add "stereo" to typical, for accuracy.

I think you need to meet some cooler trans people and retire the pop psychology.

John wrote:Article is douchey and I'm sure that site is full of dickheads, but for Devi/Grace to say that the donation was somehow a way of making up for letting people down, when in fact it is yet another betrayal of the backers, well that's a load of crap indeed. Add the pathetic starvation suicide threats etc and you've got another shitstorm of drama and self pity. Aka another classic Devi Ever move, and I'm sorry to say this but a stereotypical trans person move. I support anyone's need to reassign themselves to the gender they are most comfortable with, but there seems to be a common strain of self-absorbed melodrama and constant dissatisfaction among the trans people I've encountered. I guess it is a symptom of the disorientation, sadness and confusion that seems to come with their conditions, but it doesn't help the cause.

edited to add "stereo" to typical, for accuracy.

So I obviously don't know the struggles of being transgender and don't want to pretend to, but dude, come on. Why does that matter? Devi being trans has nothing to do with this. That's like saying "typical black behavior" or any other stereotypical thing you could say. Depression does not only attack those of us that are trans gender. I'm bipolar and have had very similar thoughts as Devi I'm sure, but I keep it together with medication, prayer and love from my friends and family.

My point is, that just seem cruel and insensitive regardless of the wrong involved.

Attack the wrong doing in question, not the fact that she's different.

I'm not attacking her difference. If anything, I'm "attacking" her predictability. If this conversation was being had in person with the mixed group of trans, drag queens and regular old queer people I know in real life, this would not be a shocking revelation. Of course this is the internet where it's easier to just assume I'm transphobic, so go right ahead I guess. Anyhoo

John wrote:there seems to be a common strain of self-absorbed melodrama and constant dissatisfaction among all the people I've encountered.

FTFY

neonblack wrote:

John wrote:there seems to be a common strain of self-absorbed melodrama and constant dissatisfaction among all the people I've encountered.

FTFY

Except that that is not true. I'm not saying it's a trait exclusive to trans people. I'm saying it is something I have observed in a pretty well-stocked demographic (upstate NY). You can disagree with my generalization but you can't just make my years of experience disappear because it doesn't fit into your narrative.

See the really lame thing about the internet is that now I'm supposed to defend myself and prove I'm not phobic, don't have a political agenda, don't secretly want to cut off my pee-pee, etc etc. Whereas in a normal group setting it would be some gay guy saying "omg that trans-bitch is such an attention whore" and nobody would blink an eye.

I'm just saying, all people are melodramatic, self absorbed, and constantly dissatisfied.

I was just hoping the conversation wouldn't even go in that direction.

You could have said "typical Devi" and left it at that. I'm not trying to make you defend yourself, and I certainly don't want to get into a gender debate on my fuzz forum. I just feel it could have been worded differently or left out altogether. I know free speech and all, but sensitivity goes a long way. I just hate to see problems with the human race in general attributed to someone's gender (or race or sexuality for that matter).

Yeah I don't even know why you had to bring the generalizations or stereotypes of trans people in to this discussion John?

Also I'd try actually talking to trans folks and what they go through on a daily basis before you call any of them melodramatic.


Also this thread is fucking stupid because the only reason it gets bumped is for people to talk shit about Devi. Yep, project failed, Devi certainly made some mistakes and pissed off people. But generally I go on here to avoid the gossipy shit talking that can permeate other areas of my life. This thread is nothing but just negative right now.

So what actually did happen with the prototype units and pcbs that were sold on ebay last year? Did anyone here win any of them?

Wes Mantooth wrote:Also this thread is fucking stupid because the only reason it gets bumped is for people to talk shit about Devi. Yep, project failed, Devi certainly made some mistakes and pissed off people. But generally I go on here to avoid the gossipy shit talking that can permeate other areas of my life. This thread is nothing but just negative right now.

you're right. i do really regret posting that article now... it wasn't meant to fuel a fire but really what did i think would happen? i was incredibly surprised to read about what happened and was just curious if anyone else was aware.

smallsnd/bigsnd wrote:

Wes Mantooth wrote:Also this thread is fucking stupid because the only reason it gets bumped is for people to talk shit about Devi. Yep, project failed, Devi certainly made some mistakes and pissed off people. But generally I go on here to avoid the gossipy shit talking that can permeate other areas of my life. This thread is nothing but just negative right now.

you're right. i do really regret posting that article now... it wasn't meant to fuel a fire but really what did i think would happen? i was incredibly surprised to read about what happened and was just curious if anyone else was aware.

I wasn't even really referencing your post Brian, more that people just start to attack aspects of her identity rather than just the project. I think we all deserved to see that story as many here had stake in this.

It goes without saying that she should probably be sued or whatever the legal recourse is. I'm all for what she donated money to, but it wasn't hers to donate. She absolutely deserves legal action to be taken against her. I just wish people would focus more on criticizing the actions she took and not just dragging up random stories and aspects of her life to talk shit about.

Why she'd advertise the illegal donation on Twitter, I have no idea

Wes Mantooth wrote:Yeah I don't even know why you had to bring the generalizations or stereotypes of trans people in to this discussion John?

Also I'd try actually talking to trans folks and what they go through on a daily basis before you call any of them melodramatic.

Here's the thing, is that I do. Some of you cats are jumping to unfounded conclusions far more than my generalization did.

Reread my original post and then consider this analogy: "9 out of 10 trans people I've met drive Subarus. Devi got a Subaru. (Stereo)typical trans move." There is nothing hateful about that, and that is the basic form of what I said.

Sorry for the derailment, and I know this is my fault for forgetting that you all don't know me. Kindness, compassion and tolerance are the most important things to me, and anyone who knows would able to contextualize my statements in a tolerant way, even if they disagreed with the conclusion, because they'd know my values and ethics already. I can't blame anyone here for not being able to do that.

John wrote:

Wes Mantooth wrote:Yeah I don't even know why you had to bring the generalizations or stereotypes of trans people in to this discussion John?

Also I'd try actually talking to trans folks and what they go through on a daily basis before you call any of them melodramatic.

Here's the thing, is that I do. Some of you cats are jumping to unfounded conclusions far more than my generalization did.

Reread my original post and then consider this analogy: "9 out of 10 trans people I've met drive Subarus. Devi got a Subaru. (Stereo)typical trans move." There is nothing hateful about that, and that is the basic form of what I said.

Sorry for the derailment, and I know this is my fault for forgetting that you all don't know me. Kindness, compassion and tolerance are the most important things to me, and anyone who knows would able to contextualize my statements in a tolerant way, even if they disagreed with the conclusion, because they'd know my values and ethics already. I can't blame anyone here for not being able to do that.

I should have said I'm absolutely not questioning you be a hateful person. I recognize you're a well respected member here and seem to be a great dude even though I don't personally know you. I'm just saying that post you made seemed unnecessary. This is purely about Devi, and it wasn't even a discussion about her gender identity. So I don't see why the whole trans community needed to brought in to the discussion ya know? I can now see your intent but how I interpreted it was a bit different so forgive the misunderstanding as I jumped to some conclusions. I just didn't think that post really contributed anything positive to this discussion.

The people of ILF are some of the nicest and welcoming people and I assume you to be no different.

I'm not saying anyone is wrong, but I want to point out that you have to be incredibly careful calling a group of people 'melodramatic' when any one member of that demographic is almost 10 times more likely to have attempted suicide than the average person.
Trans people have to deal with so much bullshit that I can't even fathom, so I think it's best to err on the side of empathy here.

I also think it's dangerous to say she did something stereotypical of a trans person, because even if maybe she did do that, and even if you have enough personal experience with trans people to be able to say that comfortably, random people on the internet are going to read what you say and potentially misinterpret it.
In my opinion it's far safer to avoid saying something like that just because of how easily that sort of thing is taken completely out of context.
All that does is give more ammunition to people who already are biased against trans people, even if you are not.

PetZounds wrote:All that does is give more ammunition to people who already are biased against trans people, even if you are not.

Beautifully worded.