needed to be said

[behndy]

creepy. if i stare at that pink mouse/rat too long i swear it moves back and forth. you should do like a 48 second moving gif with just a twitch every loop. FREAK. OUT.

yah, i see what you're saying. i'm not a professional musician, not even close to the pull as BBC, but i guess what rings true is the difference in club attitudes from when i was younger to now. i took about 10 years off of gigging from 22ish through 33ish. and unless it's rose-coloroed I'll Never Watch Robocop Again And Ruin My Memories Of It'isms, i DO remember clubs doing a LOT more to promote. from something as simple as having themed nights to paying for some advertising. and it sounds a bit naive, but i DO remember bands that clubs felt had potential but didn't draw a lot getting put with better known bands to help get them some following. not with touring acts, but same genre locals that are doing well.

all kinds of little things that helped keep a vibrant scene in each genre of live music. now there's so many times i've been stuck on a bill with a mellow band and a metal band and a crappy light rock wannabe date rape radio band....... and if you don't bring in X amount of people the booker hates you. and half the time talks shit.

[Chankgeez]

pink mouse/rat?

Dude, that's a purple squirrel.

Yeah, I think things have changed over the years with regard to the live music landscape. The poor economy definitely makes it felt to all. Times are tough.

Fostering a vibrant scene is the key (and the "talent buyer" is the one who holds it). Longstanding supportive relationships are crucial to success.

Really, most people just don't know what they're doing. That's where all the conflict comes in.

[behndy]

for sure. i KNOW that i don't know shit about how clubs are run.

urm. durp. i MEANT purple. i can see that it's purple. i just REALLLLLLLLLY like pink i guess. but i'm not buying that's a squirrel. a rat giving a mouse a backpack ride passing themselves OFF as a squirrel? ....... i'm listenin'.

[Chankgeez]

http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=purple+squirrel+jersey+shore+pa&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

[MSUsousaphone]

I see what you're saying but I think that you're missing most of the point of the article.

What the writer suggested is that owners shouldn't be searching for a band that brings in people. A lot of times that's not a factor of quality of music....more of number of friends who are able to get out frequently. It might be anecdotal to me and the writer, but most of the time the two are not dependent on each other. I've seen PLENTY of horrible bands that draw because their friends are college kids looking to go out and have fun and I've seen many excellent bands not draw at all because they're older and their cohorts don't get out as much. Same style of music, too.

The writer suggests, and I think it's a good point, that while that crappy band that draws might get people in the door that night, those friends of theirs went to the bar to see the band play won't be back. They got people there for one night. That's it. And the excellent band might not draw as much, but those people that just happen to go to the bar tonight not knowing who was playing will be more likely to go back to that bar....especially if that's the type of people the bar brings in consistently.

So instead of the strategy of booking the band who draws most, pick the quality band time and time, again. The bar patrons will build up. Not band fans. But actual patrons. Let's face it, bars last about as long as most bands. It might be safe to say they're doing it wrong.

Again, anecdotal, but the oldest and by far the most profitable gives guarantees. We play there for $800. Not a cover band. And original band. When we play at the 2nd best are venue we praise God when the door nets us $150. Others we might get $50 on some nights. The craziest thing is the bar that gives us $800 would have the same number of people their if they just turned on the booty dancing music and didn't hire a band at all. They also make and pay for all the flyers. The cheap venues don't promote at all and would have maybe 5-10 people go by if no bands were playing.

And no. Music is not ALWAYS subjective. Yeah people have tastes in what they like and don't like but pretty much everyone can tell a well rehearsed group of talented musicians from noobs.

[behndy]

http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=purple+squirrel+jersey+shore+pa&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

WAT.

that's........ kinda....... awesome.

Team Rat Mouse fooled THE INTERNET!

[Chankgeez]

I didn't think I missed the point of the article, but I may have.

I understand that the writer feels that venue owners are more interested in what bands can do for them financially than with artistic merits. I know that a band's draw and the legitimacy of their art aren't one and the same, but a draw is a draw. Friends or not. Like I said, there has to be paying customers for a band to get paid. No one wants to lose money. Unless your draw is a proven thing, it's a gamble. Musicians need to prove that they're capable of attracting a audience. Otherwise you're hiring blind.

Bars that have live music to attract business and clubs that operate as dedicated live music venues are based on totally different business models. Usually, bar owners who think along the lines that live music brings in customers don't know what they're doing. (A gross generalization, I know.) Live music shouldn't be a casual afterthought.

And, sousa, you and I can tell a well rehearsed group of talented musicians from noobs, but not everyone can.

[Chankgeez]

http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=purple+squirrel+jersey+shore+pa&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

WAT.

that's........ kinda....... awesome.

Team Rat Mouse fooled THE INTERNET!

What I think is even more awesome is that there's a town in Pennsylvania called Jersey Shore.

[behndy]

*shudders*

it's.... BREEDING.

[MSUsousaphone]

Musicians would be surprised just how much the average person can tell about music.

But nah, that's not the main point. The main point is that owners are shortsighted. They book the bands that will bring in more people THAT NIGHT but it's people who follow that band....not people who will return for the venue. As opposed to the band that might bring less that night, but more returning people.

His strategy isn't just better for musicians, it's ultimately better for the venue in the long run. Symbiotic.

I think you got a whole different tone that what was intended. The article is looking to help both the band and the venue.

[Astricii]

They lost me when the hommies in the comment section started blaming it on garage bands and other forms of lesser talent. we can't get played because any ass hole with fuzz pedals who can't play Jazz or "REAL MUSIC" is stiffing us out of our money. stupid talentless fucks.


FUCK YOU!!
ROCK AND ROLL HAPPENED, DEAL WITH IT

[dubkitty]

the thing i find off-putting about the article is the writer's seeming expectiation that things will or can revert to some halcyon previous state when venues booked by quality only and had loyal followings who'd go to see stuff on trust of the good taste of the booking agent. i don't know where he's living, but the last time i'm aware of that happening was either Bill Graham's original Fillmore or, at most recent in the US, the salad days of CBGB. maybe the Hacienda. i'm afraid that ship sailed a quarter-century ago.

[dubkitty]

and those people in the comments! Jesus. we're so special, we deserve to be com-pen-sa-ted. and bands should do their part by only playing their home town three times a year. poor old R.E.M. would have been fucked under that policy. not to mention the Velvet Underground. or the Beatles. seriously, that's got to be about the stupidest thing i've ever heard.

[Chankgeez]

If that's what you got from it, then, yeah, I guess I missed the point. The author's intent is lost on me. I don't see most of what he's talking about as being helpful.

I didn't even read the comments either.

[behndy]

oh no. NEVER read the comments. like, on Paheal or 4chan? sure. everywhere else? GAWDS NO.